Does Anyone Make a Living Doing Public Art? A Money Story with Liz LaManche

Liz LaManche (she/they) is an artist on a mission to add more color and fun to the world through big art in public places and small art in weird places.

Hannah Cole: Tell me about what brought you to a place where you wanted to learn more about taxes and getting your money organized.

Liz LaManche: I spent a bunch of years in software doing UX/UI consulting, so I had practice doing that, and getting decent rates, and doing contract negotiations, so that wasn’t the hard part. The hard part has been figuring out what artists get paid, and all that learning I talked to you about. Being avoidant about money in general. Not wanting to know my budget, not keeping track of receipts, even though at the end of the year I had this big terrible accounting project of tallying all my receipts. 

You’re the first person who has been able to teach me in a calm, accessible way. I had old men accountants who said they would teach me, but then actually just asked for my numbers which they would just enter into their system. When I would ask them questions, they would say, “Just read the instructions on the form.”
The fact that you’re able to realize in a psychological way what is going on with people, gently and realistically, has been really nice.

This was part of a program I set myself where I was intending to get better at the financial thing, and set myself up better. I’m examining, “What are my attitudes? What is keeping me from getting specific? From actually tackling this stuff?” You helped with the specifics--as in, here’s how to do this and that.

I think psychologically, I bounce between overfunctioning and underfunctioning. I can’t deal, and then I bounce back. I have a tendency to want to get everything done perfectly, then I can’t deal anymore. You’ve been very helpful about putting it all in perspective. You say, if you improve one thing, you’re headed in the right direction. It doesn’t need to be all perfect immediately. 

I would go from ignoring my receipts for months, to “I have to enter every 50 cent coffee I ever get into this spreadsheet.”

HC: What did you observe in your transition from consulting work to the art world?

LL: Being up front with clear communication took practice. I got good at writing contracts that were basically in English that people normally speak, but take care of contingencies that both parties actually care about. You need to spell it all out in an understandable way, and to have it covered in a contract. A lot of my artwork is commissions and consulting.

HC: So you really have to use contracts for that. 

LL: Yeah. You have to lay out what is going to be done in this project.

HC: Can you describe your art?

LL: I’m doing public art and murals. I’m also working with an organization that helps cities and towns work on their pedestrian access, safer streets, bikeways, and designing asphalt art. I make artistic crosswalks, intersections, and pathways. I get to use my architecture background, making urban environments more beautiful, and sustaining human beings. It has been helpful coming from being an architecture major. First, you have to figure out what the client wants and needs, and what environment the client is in. Then you design something bespoke to solve those problems and make something that is both beautiful and usable within its environment and neighborhood. 

Business skills have helped a lot in the project work I’m doing. Being able to form a relationship with clients where they feel taken care of, and they are sure I know what I’m doing, because I approach things like a pro, I know what the issues are, and I can get them a solution that works for them. I show up and behave like a professional. People dealing with artists are a bit afraid about that.

HC: Has there been anything particularly helpful that you have learned?

LL: I had some habits that helped me already. I can do math, I had business bank accounts, I can use spreadsheets. But others you helped me a lot with were--I couldn’t face my receipts, and keep a running tally of what was going on. I couldn’t look at my actual financial situation. I would just try to get money coming in and hope that things worked out. Then I would panic if the account balance got too low. 

Following your program, I’ve been able to get a handle on things, know where I’m at, develop some good habits (if not make and stick to an actual plan). Things like getting more methodical about putting money aside, being able to check on it, that sort of thing. Being able to get on top of the quarterly tax thing, and what I should be doing taxwise, has made me a lot happier and calmer. 

HC: That stuff provokes so much anxiety.

LL: It’s just astonishing that no other tax person has gotten me to do quarterlies ever.

HC: I’m so proud

LL: One of the things I’m working on now is trying to learn more about what artists are getting paid, in my field and in others. I want to learn more about what’s realistic. Because there’s so much secrecy around money all the time. That doesn’t serve us well.

I spent some time in circus performance doing aerial dance, and there’s a lot of talk there about “charge what you’re worth” and “don’t undercut others,” and how to get people a living wage.

The same is true in performance. There’s the thing or service you’re selling, and then there’s the years of work and study that made you good at doing that thing. There's more overhead than people expect.

I would love for art to be a sustainable thing for more people. Because it's such an important thing for our culture, and for being able to sustain ourselves as a society.

There’s awe and beauty--those uplifting feelings. In public art, too - you’re getting beautiful things out to people who are just getting through their day, in what would otherwise be a dull streetscape. It might make their day better.

I’ve heard about people quoting extremely low rates, basically doing things for free. That’s problematic because it leads to that being the expectation. And there should be a graduated scale based on your experience, and the type of work and that sort of thing. But that’s the question that we run into in circus arts, too. There has to be a place for people to start, but people commissioning work need to realize there’s a difference in the final quality, too.

I’m hoping that there is a tier for professional artists to stay professional and make a career of it.

People look at me as someone who is successful, because I’ve done projects that are known around town. [But I’m still wondering], “Does anyone get a living wage doing public art?”